Hi,

Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or to
run Sibelius.

On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
choices and an error box.

Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning rust). h-6
is an ssd for backup.

I eventually got to the desktop.

Running DiscKnight told me both discs were fine.

After much experimenting, happily opening directories and files on each
disc; trying to run applications, some of which opened, some didn't;
running the scanner which worked, I was utterly confused.

Then I fired it up for the umpteenth time and finally properly clocked
the sequence on screen thus...

Shows normal banners eg Risc OS 4.39
Strong Arm
Risc OS Adjust 1i2

Risc OS ADFS

That last line is wrong. Surely it should be IDEFS.

What would make the machine change its behaviour?

Could it be a CMOS and battery problem?

If I go through the configure boot, opt business will I get everything
back?

I'll investigate more tomorrow. My brain hurts now.

Any enlightenment gratefully received.

Regards,

--
Chris

In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>,
Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> Any enlightenment gratefully received.

It does sound like a disc issue to me. Although !DiscKnight is good at
finding and fixing errors, you need to do a verify to be sure. I would
recommend you do a full backup ASAP and look to replacing the disc.

--
Stuart Winsor

Tools With A Mission
sending tools across the world
http://www.twam.co.uk/

In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>,
Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> Hi,

> Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or to
> run Sibelius.

> On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> choices and an error box.

> Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning rust).
> h-6 is an ssd for backup.

Disc error 21 is usually when the disc can't be found. The error is from
drive 4. Did the error come from ADFS or IDEFS? If you don't have an ADFS
drive fitted, maybe it's become configured to be there, so not being
found?

Andrew

--
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
| Andrew Conroy, Owl-Art Un-Ltd. | email: a.m.conroy@argonet.co.uk |
| Coming to you on an Acorn RiscPC SA110 | |
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
The impossible I can do at once, miracles take a little longer!!

In article <5b5a6ebda7a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk>, Andrew Conroy
<a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> > Hi,

> > Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or
> > to run Sibelius.

> > On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> > After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> > choices and an error box.

> > Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> > The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning rust).
> > h-6 is an ssd for backup.

> Disc error 21 is usually when the disc can't be found. The error is
> from drive 4. Did the error come from ADFS or IDEFS? If you don't have
> an ADFS drive fitted, maybe it's become configured to be there, so not
> being found?

Yes. M/c is looking for ADFS instead of IDEFS. How could that have
changed?

CMOS problem? Interruption to power supply resulting in improper shutdown?

--
Chris

In article <5b5aada81cmec@npost.uk>,
Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> In article <5b5a6ebda7a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk>, Andrew Conroy
> <a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk> wrote:
> > In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> > > Hi,

> > > Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or
> > > to run Sibelius.

> > > On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> > > After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> > > choices and an error box.

> > > Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> > > The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning
> > > rust). h-6 is an ssd for backup.

> > Disc error 21 is usually when the disc can't be found. The error is
> > from drive 4. Did the error come from ADFS or IDEFS? If you don't have
> > an ADFS drive fitted, maybe it's become configured to be there, so not
> > being found?

> Yes. M/c is looking for ADFS instead of IDEFS. How could that have
> changed?

Aha. Type
*Configure IDEDiscs 0

to return the ADFS discs to zero.

> CMOS problem?

Possibly.

> Interruption to power supply resulting in improper shutdown?

Unlikely. CMOS settings are not saved to the chip at shutdown, but as
soon as you make a change to them, so not shutting down won't affect CMOS
entries.

If it happens again, or other CMOS settings change without you changing
them, it's something to look in to, if it doesn't happen again, put it
down to "one of those things".

Andrew

--
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
| Andrew Conroy, Owl-Art Un-Ltd. | email: a.m.conroy@argonet.co.uk |
| Coming to you on an Acorn RiscPC SA110 | |
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
The impossible I can do at once, miracles take a little longer!!

In article <5b5aada81cmec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> In article <5b5a6ebda7a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk>, Andrew Conroy
> <a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk> wrote:
> > In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk>
> > wrote:
> > > Hi,

> > > Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or
> > > to run Sibelius.

> > > On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> > > After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> > > choices and an error box.

> > > Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> > > The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning
> > > rust). h-6 is an ssd for backup.

> > Disc error 21 is usually when the disc can't be found. The error is
> > from drive 4. Did the error come from ADFS or IDEFS? If you don't
> > have an ADFS drive fitted, maybe it's become configured to be there,
> > so not being found?

> Yes. M/c is looking for ADFS instead of IDEFS. How could that have
> changed?

> CMOS problem?

RiscPC Strong ARMv4 Adjust 4.39 with Unipod.

To ensure the RPC boots from the Unipod, I was about to reset the
relevant configuration. I looked in the Unipod help guide, the Risc OS 3
User Guide and its release notes and got 3 different orders of events.

Does this look right?

*Configure Boot
*idefs selects the file system
*drive <N> changes the current drive to N . Mine h-4
*Opt4,2 <N> changes the option on the current drive to N (0 or 2)
*configure filesystem IDEFS

Not quite sure why the Unipod instructions appear to have the fiesystem
being set twice.

Any enlightenment gratefully received.

--
Chris

In article <5b5bf2de6bmec@npost.uk>,
Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> In article <5b5aada81cmec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> > In article <5b5a6ebda7a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk>, Andrew Conroy
> > <a.m.conroy@owlart.co.uk> wrote:
> > > In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk>
> > > wrote:
> > > > Hi,

> > > > Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner
> > > > or to run Sibelius.

> > > > On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> > > > After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> > > > choices and an error box.

> > > > Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> > > > The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning
> > > > rust). h-6 is an ssd for backup.

> > > Disc error 21 is usually when the disc can't be found. The error is
> > > from drive 4. Did the error come from ADFS or IDEFS? If you don't
> > > have an ADFS drive fitted, maybe it's become configured to be there,
> > > so not being found?

> > Yes. M/c is looking for ADFS instead of IDEFS. How could that have
> > changed?

> > CMOS problem?

> RiscPC Strong ARMv4 Adjust 4.39 with Unipod.

> To ensure the RPC boots from the Unipod, I was about to reset the
> relevant configuration. I looked in the Unipod help guide, the Risc OS 3
> User Guide and its release notes and got 3 different orders of events.

> Does this look right?

> *Configure Boot

This just ensures that "Boot is run, it doesn't say where rom.

> *idefs selects the file system
> *drive <N> changes the current drive to N . Mine h-4

These are temporary, and only works for your current session, so won't
persist beyond a power down, or reset.

> *Opt4,2 <N> changes the option on the current drive to N (0 or 2)

Assuming that it did boot from the drive in IDEFS this is probably
redundant as it will already be set to this.

> *configure filesystem IDEFS

This configures the computer to look for !Boot on the IDEFS file system.
This setting is retained over a reset or power down.

> Not quite sure why the Unipod instructions appear to have the fiesystem
> being set twice.

One is temporary, one is 'permanant'. If you needed to change the OPT
settings for the drive, you would need to specify the IDEFS drive by
selecting IDEFS and the drive number, but generally this is set when you
format the drive and never changed. You can see what it's currently set
to by typing
*IDEFS
*.

at the command line.

> Any enlightenment gratefully received.

Hope this helps, if not then probably easiest to discuss it at the SROUG
meeting next week.

Andrew

--
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
| Andrew Conroy, Owl-Art Un-Ltd. | email: a.m.conroy@argonet.co.uk |
| Coming to you on an Acorn RiscPC SA110 | |
+----------------------------------------+---------------------------------+
The impossible I can do at once, miracles take a little longer!!

In article <5b59662272mec@npost.uk>, Chris Newman <mec@npost.uk> wrote:
> Hi,

> Every now and again I fire up the Risc PC to use the old scanner or to
> run Sibelius.

> On Saturday it didn't start up properly.

> After an aeon it eventually got the the green screen with the boot
> choices and an error box.

> Disc error 21 at :4/00 000 000 000 000 6

> The m/c has a Simtec unipod. It should boot from h-4 (Spinning rust).
> h-6 is an ssd for backup.

> I eventually got to the desktop.

Problem solved. By resetting lots of parameters I got it to the stage
where it would boot properly from the green screen with the list of
startup options by choosing IDEFS drive 4.
I took the RiscPC to our local RiscOS group at Southampton where Andrew
Conroy went throught it with a fine tooth comb. He surmised (correctly)
that because I only used the machine sporadically, it hadn't been on for
enough time to recharge the CMOS battery so was losing its settings.
Andrew suggested a straight run of 8 hours per week should keep the
battery healthy.

He then checked for unplugged modules. None were unplugged. That
triggered my little grey cells. In the dim and distant past when I set up
the Unipod, I remember the Simtec instruction that if you put the CD Rom
drive on the unipod instead of the motherboard, you had to unplug
softATAPI.
Having lost the CMOS settings it had reverted to the default setting of
plugged in.
ATAPI unplugged, machine back to normal.

All now fine.

--
Chris

On 16 May 2024 as I do recall,
Chris Newman wrote:

[snip]

> In the dim and distant past when I set up the Unipod, I remember the
> Simtec instruction that if you put the CD Rom drive on the unipod
> instead of the motherboard, you had to unplug softATAPI. Having lost
> the CMOS settings it had reverted to the default setting of plugged
> in. ATAPI unplugged, machine back to normal.
>
Aha!

--
Harriet Bazley == Loyaulte me lie ==

The best laid schemes o' mice and men gang oft a-gley.