Lately I have been unable to create a new account at mixnym.net.
Lack of hsub nym messages in AAM would further suggest that something is
amiss with your hsub nymserver. Maybe something broke when you migrated
to Debian Bullseye?

--
SEC3

YAMN Tutorials - https://sec3.net/yamnhelp

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

On Thu, 9 Dec 2021 18:13:15 -0500, SEC3 wrote in
Message-Id: <g4wsJ.484888$ptt8.351070@fx06.ams1>:

> Lately I have been unable to create a new account at mixnym.net.
> Lack of hsub nym messages in AAM would further suggest that something is
> amiss with your hsub nymserver. Maybe something broke when you migrated
> to Debian Bullseye?

Hi SEC3,

Thanks for your messages. Yes, it looks like the Bullseye upgrade has
broken mixnym in a fairly spectacular manner. Upgrading the code to
python3 was pretty simple but the GnuPGInterface library it relies on
has been discontinued. Worse still, the reason for its discontinuation
is that it suffers from multiple security issues. There are other GnuPG
libraries for Python but rewriting the code is going to take a while.

I'm also trying to fix the mailing list. It's another victim of python2
being discontinued. There is a mailman3 for python3 but it's not a
simple upgrade. If anyone else feels like hosting a mailing list, I'm
happy to provide the archive files.

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--
pub 1024D/228761E7 2003-06-04 Steven Crook <steve@mixmin.net>
Key fingerprint = 1CD9 95E1 E9CE 80D6 C885 B7EB B471 80D5 2287 61E7
ssb rsa4096/832C8F4DCD904263 created: 2019-05-04 expires: 2024-05-02 usage: S

On 12/12/21 11:56 AM, Zax wrote:
> Thanks for your messages. Yes, it looks like the Bullseye upgrade
> has broken mixnym in a fairly spectacular manner.

<monotone>oy vey</monotone>

> Upgrading the code to python3 was pretty simple but the GnuPGInterface
> library it relies on has been discontinued.

Yet another example of why I want to /never/ write anything I care about
in Python.

> Worse still, the reason for its discontinuation is that it suffers
> from multiple security issues. There are other GnuPG libraries for
> Python but rewriting the code is going to take a while.

Ugh.

> I'm also trying to fix the mailing list. It's another victim of
> python2 being discontinued. There is a mailman3 for python3 but it's
> not a simple upgrade.

Mailman v3 is a completely different beast than prior versions of
Mailman. When i say /beast/, I mean it. My understanding is that
Mailman v3 uses a completely different operating model which requires
multiple non-trivial, if not actually large, sub-systems outside of
Mailman to function. Somewhat akin to Oh, I've now got to install a
full RDBMS (PostgreSQL / MySQL / what-have-you) in order to run the new
version of this $THING. Bleck.

I think I'll be migrating away from Mailman if / when I need to go away
from Mailman v2.

> If anyone else feels like hosting a mailing list, I'm happy to provide
> the archive files.

I've got a Mailman v2 instance and I'm willing to talk about hosting
things. I'm not sure how to deal with the address change for the
mailing list. I'm sure there's a technical solution. I just don't know
what it is (yet). Forwarding email from your address / server to mine
comes to mind. As does having my server fetch(mail) messages from your
server and then do an authenticated SMTP out through your server.
<monotone>joy</monotone>

--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

On 12/12/21 11:56 AM, Zax wrote:
> Yes, it looks like the Bullseye upgrade has broken mixnym in a fairly
> spectacular manner.

Is there any way to put your remailers into testing mode so that
/hopefully/ other people won't inadvertently use them while you're
resolving the issues?

I've now seen more than 200 messages be rejected thus lost.

--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

On 2021-12-12 2:30 p.m., Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 12/12/21 11:56 AM, Zax wrote:
>> Yes, it looks like the Bullseye upgrade has broken mixnym in a fairly
>> spectacular manner.
>
> Is there any way to put your remailers into testing mode so that
> /hopefully/ other people won't inadvertently use them while you're
> resolving the issues?
>

Zax hosts his nymserver at mixnym.net which he now confirms is broken.
But his remailers are hosted at mixmin.net

I run the Orange mixmaster remailer. From my perspective I am not seeing
any delivery problems to/from mixmin.net.

> I've now seen more than 200 messages be rejected thus lost.

I'm sorry to hear that.

--
SEC3

YAMN Tutorials - https://sec3.net/yamnhelp

On 2021-12-12 4:08 p.m., SEC3 wrote:

> I run the Orange mixmaster remailer. From my perspective I am not seeing
> any delivery problems to/from mixmin.net.

Sorry, I take that back. On closer inspection I do see about 115 bounces
siiting in Orange's mbox.bounce file.

<banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: host fleegle.mixmin.net[144.76.182.167]
said: 550 5.1.1 <banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: Recipient address
rejected: User unknown in local recipient table (in reply to RCPT TO
command)

--
SEC3

YAMN Tutorials - https://sec3.net/yamnhelp

On 2021-12-12 9:14 p.m., SEC3 wrote:
> On 2021-12-12 4:08 p.m., SEC3 wrote:
>
>> I run the Orange mixmaster remailer. From my perspective I am not
>> seeing any delivery problems to/from mixmin.net.
>
> Sorry, I take that back. On closer inspection I do see about 115 bounces
> siiting in Orange's mbox.bounce file.
>
> <banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: host fleegle.mixmin.net[144.76.182.167]
> said:  550 5.1.1 <banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: Recipient address
> rejected: User unknown in local recipient table (in reply to RCPT TO
> command)
>

Zax seems to have addressed this issue. 'No more bounces at Orange.

--
SEC3

YAMN Tutorials - https://sec3.net/yamnhelp

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 22:16:57 -0500, SEC3 wrote in
Message-Id: <K0UtJ.703649$eFGb.380738@fx14.ams1>:

> On 2021-12-12 9:14 p.m., SEC3 wrote:
>> On 2021-12-12 4:08 p.m., SEC3 wrote:
>>
>>> I run the Orange mixmaster remailer. From my perspective I am not
>>> seeing any delivery problems to/from mixmin.net.
>>
>> Sorry, I take that back. On closer inspection I do see about 115 bounces
>> siiting in Orange's mbox.bounce file.
>>
>> <banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: host fleegle.mixmin.net[144.76.182.167]
>> said:  550 5.1.1 <banana@mixmaster.mixmin.net>: Recipient address
>> rejected: User unknown in local recipient table (in reply to RCPT TO
>> command)
>>
>
> Zax seems to have addressed this issue. 'No more bounces at Orange.

Hopefully it was a very short blip. I installed mailman3 and did the
basic setup for it. Unfortunately the setup included a local recipients
table that effectively denies any recipient except mailman3. Not very
helpful!

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--
pub 1024D/228761E7 2003-06-04 Steven Crook <steve@mixmin.net>
Key fingerprint = 1CD9 95E1 E9CE 80D6 C885 B7EB B471 80D5 2287 61E7
ssb rsa4096/832C8F4DCD904263 created: 2019-05-04 expires: 2024-05-02 usage: S

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

On Sun, 12 Dec 2021 12:20:47 -0700, Grant Taylor wrote in
Message-Id: <sp5i3l$itb$1@tncsrv09.home.tnetconsulting.net>:

> On 12/12/21 11:56 AM, Zax wrote:
>> Thanks for your messages. Yes, it looks like the Bullseye upgrade
>> has broken mixnym in a fairly spectacular manner.
>
><monotone>oy vey</monotone>
>
>> Upgrading the code to python3 was pretty simple but the GnuPGInterface
>> library it relies on has been discontinued.
>
> Yet another example of why I want to /never/ write anything I care about
> in Python.

In fairness to Python, that nymserver code has been running for well
over a decade. When I did the previous Debian upgrade, I remember
experiencing issues with GnuPGInterface and having to use pip to get it
installed. I got it working and haven't touched it since. It's
probably one of the last things I did write in Python.

>> Worse still, the reason for its discontinuation is that it suffers
>> from multiple security issues. There are other GnuPG libraries for
>> Python but rewriting the code is going to take a while.
>
> Ugh.
I take your Ugh and raise it to 2 Ughs. GnuPG had its time but it's not
the way to exchange blobs of programatically generated data. The likes
of NaCl have succeeded it. I'm sorry to say that mixnym is unlikely to
return. It would take a ton of work, be incompatible with old mixnym
and wouldn't be of the same quality as modern systems like Katzenpost.

>> I'm also trying to fix the mailing list. It's another victim of
>> python2 being discontinued. There is a mailman3 for python3 but it's
>> not a simple upgrade.
>
> Mailman v3 is a completely different beast than prior versions of
> Mailman. When i say /beast/, I mean it. My understanding is that
> Mailman v3 uses a completely different operating model which requires
> multiple non-trivial, if not actually large, sub-systems outside of
> Mailman to function. Somewhat akin to Oh, I've now got to install a
> full RDBMS (PostgreSQL / MySQL / what-have-you) in order to run the new
> version of this $THING. Bleck.
>
> I think I'll be migrating away from Mailman if / when I need to go away
> from Mailman v2.
>
>> If anyone else feels like hosting a mailing list, I'm happy to provide
>> the archive files.
>
> I've got a Mailman v2 instance and I'm willing to talk about hosting
> things. I'm not sure how to deal with the address change for the
> mailing list. I'm sure there's a technical solution. I just don't know
> what it is (yet). Forwarding email from your address / server to mine
> comes to mind. As does having my server fetch(mail) messages from your
> server and then do an authenticated SMTP out through your server.
><monotone>joy</monotone>

I'm happy to set that up but it's probably overkill for the volume of
messages the mailing list sees. When I took on the Remops mailing list,
cira May 2005, it was heavily used. Remops and other interested parties
just reregistered on the new list. My regret was not getting the
archive from the previous operator. Lots of interesting history was
lost.

I've got history going back to when I took it on. It includes messages
from legends like Len Sassaman who ran the randseed remailer, Weasel
who ran rot26 and Janis Jagers (Disastry).

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--
pub 1024D/228761E7 2003-06-04 Steven Crook <steve@mixmin.net>
Key fingerprint = 1CD9 95E1 E9CE 80D6 C885 B7EB B471 80D5 2287 61E7
ssb rsa4096/832C8F4DCD904263 created: 2019-05-04 expires: 2024-05-02 usage: S

On 12/18/2021 8:50 AM, Zax wrote:

>> Ugh.
> I take your Ugh and raise it to 2 Ughs. GnuPG had its time but it's not
> the way to exchange blobs of programatically generated data. The likes
> of NaCl have succeeded it. I'm sorry to say that mixnym is unlikely to
> return. It would take a ton of work, be incompatible with old mixnym
> and wouldn't be of the same quality as modern systems like Katzenpost.

Steve, you say, "I'm sorry to say that mixnym is unlikely to
return."

Understood.

Will existing Mixnym nyms still function?

On 12/18/21 7:50 AM, Zax wrote:
> In fairness to Python....

ACK

> I take your Ugh and raise it to 2 Ughs. GnuPG had its time but it's
> not the way to exchange blobs of programatically generated data.
> The likes of NaCl have succeeded it.

Would you please elaborate?

I'm only a casual user of PGP / GPG and even most of that is abstracted
away behind things like a password vault or Enigmail.

Will NaCl (or other lib-sodium? counterparts) step up and get support
for email a la. Enigmail or will package managers start using it in a
similar role that they use GPG?

> I'm sorry to say that mixnym is unlikely to return. It would take a
> ton of work, be incompatible with old mixnym and wouldn't be of the
> same quality as modern systems like Katzenpost.

Time moves on and things change. But that doesn't make it any more
palatable.

> I'm happy to set that up but it's probably overkill for the volume
> of messages the mailing list sees.

Fair enough.

The offer stands.

> I've got history going back to when I took it on. It includes messages
> from legends like Len Sassaman who ran the randseed remailer, Weasel
> who ran rot26 and Janis Jagers (Disastry).

Would it be worth while to archive that history somewhere? Possibly The
Internet Archive?

--
Grant. . . .
unix || die

Grant Taylor <gtaylor@tnetconsulting.net> wrote:
>
>
> > I've got history going back to when I took it on. It includes messages
> > from legends like Len Sassaman who ran the randseed remailer, Weasel
> > who ran rot26 and Janis Jagers (Disastry).
>
> Would it be worth while to archive that history somewhere? Possibly The
> Internet Archive?
>
>
Archiving the history at the Internet Archive is a great idea.