Rocksolid Light

Welcome to novaBBS (click a section below)

mail  files  register  newsreader  groups  login

Message-ID:  

We have nowhere else to go... this is all we have. -- Margaret Mead


interests / alt.law-enforcement / Re: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat

SubjectAuthor
* Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreata425couple
`- Re: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreatreb grundy

1
Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat

<ToDXN.52029$neD.43290@fx11.iad>

  copy mid

https://news.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=4338&group=alt.law-enforcement#4338

  copy link   Newsgroups: or.politics seattle.politics alt.law-enforcement ca.politics
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!news.neodome.net!npeer.as286.net!npeer-ng0.as286.net!peer02.ams1!peer.ams1.xlned.com!news.xlned.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!fx11.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Newsgroups: or.politics,seattle.politics,alt.law-enforcement,ca.politics
Content-Language: en-US
From: a425cou...@hotmail.com (a425couple)
Subject: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Lines: 162
Message-ID: <ToDXN.52029$neD.43290@fx11.iad>
X-Complaints-To: abuse(at)newshosting.com
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 02:15:15 UTC
Organization: Newshosting.com - Highest quality at a great price! www.newshosting.com
Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2024 19:15:14 -0700
X-Received-Bytes: 8755
 by: a425couple - Mon, 29 Apr 2024 02:15 UTC

Even the very liberal Westneat recognizes the retreat from
far liberalism.

from
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/even-portland-now-is-banning-camping-part-of-the-west-coast-retreat/

Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat
April 27, 2024 at 6:00 am Updated April 27, 2024 at 6:00 am
In this aerial photo, tents housing people without shelter are set up on
a vacant parking lot in Portland. (Craig Mitchelldyer / The Associated
Press, 2020)
A line of tents is shown in the Old Town neighborhood in downtown
Portland. (Beth Nakamura / The Oregonian, 2021)

1 of 2 | In this aerial photo, tents housing people without shelter are
set up on a vacant parking lot in Portland. (Craig Mitchelldyer / The
Associated Press, 2020)

Danny Westneat By Danny Westneat
Seattle Times columnist
We continue up and down the best coast this week, taking the temperature
of Seattle’s sister cities. First stop is Portland, where the mood is …
spent.

It’s fair to say no city has been more adventurous and experimental in
trying to tackle the homelessness and drug crises. From allowing tent
camping in parks citywide at one point to decriminalizing drug use to
passing higher income taxes for shelter, housing and homelessness
services, Portland has over the past decade gone all in on the
progressive project.

But like San Francisco, and to some extent Seattle, Portland is in
retreat from that now.

This past week, the Portland mayor and City Council advanced a ban on
camping in the city — with possible jail time as a penalty.

“All it takes is one look at the situation on Portland streets to
acknowledge that the status quo is not working,” the Portland mayor, Ted
Wheeler, said.

The proposed ordinance makes it illegal to camp on public property
unless no shelter beds are available. Like Seattle, Portland has more
people living outside than it has shelter beds, so this exception
acknowledges there will still be camping around town.

Pointedly, though, the ban applies if the person has “otherwise been
offered and rejected reasonable alternate shelter.”

People choosing to stay in unauthorized encampments, rather than go to
shelter, has become a major sticking point. In Seattle last year, the
city said it made 2,200 referrals to shelters, but only 970 times did
anyone take them up on it. It means more than half the time, people are
opting to stay outside in parks or under bridges rather than use the
offered shelter, even if they have to move from camp to camp.

A few years ago, the Seattle Times profiled an encampment sweep where
everyone living there was offered shelter, and no one took it.

In Portland they appear to be done with that. The ordinance, which was
the softer of the two being debated last week, threatens up to seven
days in jail.

It also bans camping on sidewalks, making fires in campsites, building
structures, digging, or storing three or more bicycles at campsites — a
sign Portland is sick of the theft rings that sometimes crop up in
unauthorized camps.

Portland’s proposed ordinance is similar to a camping ban in Burien that
King County is refusing to enforce, on the grounds it’s cruel and maybe
unconstitutional. So like San Francisco, which just voted to deny
welfare benefits to recipients who fail drug tests, Portland suddenly
seems to be vaulting to the right of Seattle politics in a search for
answers.

Our other stop is up north, in British Columbia, where they are in month
15 of a three-year experiment on decriminalizing hard drugs.

According to my opposite number at the Vancouver Sun, columnist Vaughn
Palmer, there have been some “shocking,” unexpected consequences —
namely the widespread use of fentanyl and other drugs in, of all places,
hospitals.

A leaked hospital memo in the province suggested nurses should help
patients use hard drugs in the hospital rooms, in pursuit of “harm
reduction,” Palmer reported.

Sign up for Evening Brief
Delivered weeknights, this email newsletter gives you a quick recap of
the day's top stories and need-to-know news, as well as intriguing
photos and topics to spark conversation as you wind down from your day.

“Offer supplies and ensure they are easily accessible,” the memo
instructed nurses. “If patient has an IV, provide education on injecting
into lines.”

It caused an uproar. It felt to some Canadians that the well-meaning
goal of decriminalization — to remove drug addiction issues from jails —
had morphed into letting people use drugs anywhere and everywhere.

As Palmer put it: “A government that sought decriminalization of hard
drugs seems to not have prepared for the consequences.”

This past week, some elected officials in the province called to end the
decriminalization experiment — as Oregon now has.

“I have never seen this kind of open drug use … this level of
encampments … this amount of suffering,” one Vancouver area city
councilor said.

My view is the through line in all these West Coast progressive failures
— yes, failures — isn’t that the big picture theory was wrong.
Progressives are right that criminalizing homelessness or drug addiction
is dumb and usually counterproductive. Jail is a sideshow at best to
ultimately solving either problem.

Most Read Local Stories
Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat
Eastside light rail line opens as huge crowds try out the ride WATCH
Woodland Park Zoo’s 45-year-old hippo, Water Lily, to be euthanized
Oregon university pauses gifts, grants from Boeing over connections to
Israel
What to expect when you try the Eastside’s eight light rail stations
But it also ought to be obvious by now that society can’t leap straight
from red light all the way to full-on green. It’s not OK to build a
plywood shack in a city park, any more than it is to smoke fentanyl on
the bus or in a hospital room. It’s also not OK to refuse shelter and
camp outside for years — not OK for the city and not for the person
doing it.

There’s got to be a middle space, where cities can still set rules and
expectations without criminalizing the underlying poverty or addiction.

Portugal is the place often credited for at least semisuccessfully
decriminalizing drugs. But they explicitly did not create an atmosphere
of anything goes. People caught with drugs in Portugal aren’t sent to
criminal courts, but they’re given a summons to go before a “drug
dissuasion” group with a doctor, a social worker and a legal expert.
That group guides a treatment program and can impose penalties, from
fines to revoking licenses to even bans on travel.

It’s no war on drugs. But it’s also not advising you how to inject drugs
into your bedside IV line.

What has happened in the West Coast cities, over and over on
homelessness, drugs and policing issues, is that we half-assed it. We
did the ideological part first, and either ignored the make-it-work part
or left it for later. Just as Seattle learned ruefully that you can’t
defund police without first setting up public safety alternatives,
Oregon found it’s self-defeating to decriminalize drugs without first
setting up a robust treatment system.

And so now the retreat is on, up and down the coast. Hopefully, as the
pendulum swings back to the right, it won’t swing too far.

If West Coast cities have learned anything from the upheaval of the past
five years, it ought to be that the worst public policy mistakes, the
kind you later have to embarrassingly unwind, happen when the pendulum
really gets to swinging.

Danny Westneat: dwestneat@seattletimes.com; Danny Westneat takes an
opinionated look at the Puget Sound region's news, people and politics.

Re: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat

<v0nf2l$3dho5$1@news.mixmin.net>

  copy mid

https://news.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=4340&group=alt.law-enforcement#4340

  copy link   Newsgroups: or.politics seattle.politics alt.law-enforcement ca.politics talk.politics.guns
Path: i2pn2.org!rocksolid2!news.neodome.net!news.mixmin.net!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rgru...@taft.com (reb grundy)
Newsgroups: or.politics,seattle.politics,alt.law-enforcement,ca.politics,talk.politics.guns
Subject: Re: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast
retreat
Date: Sun, 28 Apr 2024 23:35:02 -0700
Organization: Mixmin
Message-ID: <v0nf2l$3dho5$1@news.mixmin.net>
References: <ToDXN.52029$neD.43290@fx11.iad>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2024 06:35:02 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: news.mixmin.net; posting-host="c4af4a3027e8317d29ea238d8aa6bb2f616aa3fc";
logging-data="3589893"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@mixmin.net"
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Content-Language: en-US
In-Reply-To: <ToDXN.52029$neD.43290@fx11.iad>
 by: reb grundy - Mon, 29 Apr 2024 06:35 UTC

On 4/28/2024 7:15 PM, a425couple wrote:
> Even the very liberal Westneat recognizes the retreat from
> far liberalism.
>
> from
> https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/even-portland-now-is-banning-camping-part-of-the-west-coast-retreat/
>
> Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat
> April 27, 2024 at 6:00 am Updated April 27, 2024 at 6:00 am
> In this aerial photo, tents housing people without shelter are set up on
> a vacant parking lot in Portland. (Craig Mitchelldyer / The Associated
> Press, 2020)
> A line of tents is shown in the Old Town neighborhood in downtown
> Portland. (Beth Nakamura / The Oregonian, 2021)
>
> 1 of 2 | In this aerial photo, tents housing people without shelter are
> set up on a vacant parking lot in Portland. (Craig Mitchelldyer / The
> Associated Press, 2020)
>
> Danny Westneat By Danny Westneat
> Seattle Times columnist
> We continue up and down the best coast this week, taking the temperature
> of Seattle’s sister cities. First stop is Portland, where the mood is …
> spent.
>
> It’s fair to say no city has been more adventurous and experimental in
> trying to tackle the homelessness and drug crises. From allowing tent
> camping in parks citywide at one point to decriminalizing drug use to
> passing higher income taxes for shelter, housing and homelessness
> services, Portland has over the past decade gone all in on the
> progressive project.
>
> But like San Francisco, and to some extent Seattle, Portland is in
> retreat from that now.
>
> This past week, the Portland mayor and City Council advanced a ban on
> camping in the city — with possible jail time as a penalty.
>
> “All it takes is one look at the situation on Portland streets to
> acknowledge that the status quo is not working,” the Portland mayor, Ted
> Wheeler, said.
>
> The proposed ordinance makes it illegal to camp on public property
> unless no shelter beds are available. Like Seattle, Portland has more
> people living outside than it has shelter beds, so this exception
> acknowledges there will still be camping around town.
>
> Pointedly, though, the ban applies if the person has “otherwise been
> offered and rejected reasonable alternate shelter.”
>
> People choosing to stay in unauthorized encampments, rather than go to
> shelter, has become a major sticking point. In Seattle last year, the
> city said it made 2,200 referrals to shelters, but only 970 times did
> anyone take them up on it. It means more than half the time, people are
> opting to stay outside in parks or under bridges rather than use the
> offered shelter, even if they have to move from camp to camp.
>
> A few years ago, the Seattle Times profiled an encampment sweep where
> everyone living there was offered shelter, and no one took it.
>
> In Portland they appear to be done with that. The ordinance, which was
> the softer of the two being debated last week, threatens up to seven
> days in jail.
>
> It also bans camping on sidewalks, making fires in campsites, building
> structures, digging, or storing three or more bicycles at campsites — a
> sign Portland is sick of the theft rings that sometimes crop up in
> unauthorized camps.

Stunning how realization strikes.

> Portland’s proposed ordinance is similar to a camping ban in Burien that
> King County is refusing to enforce, on the grounds it’s cruel and maybe
> unconstitutional. So like San Francisco, which just voted to deny
> welfare benefits to recipients who fail drug tests, Portland suddenly
> seems to be vaulting to the right of Seattle politics in a search for
> answers.
>
> Our other stop is up north, in British Columbia, where they are in month
> 15 of a three-year experiment on decriminalizing hard drugs.
>
> According to my opposite number at the Vancouver Sun, columnist Vaughn
> Palmer, there have been some “shocking,” unexpected consequences —
> namely the widespread use of fentanyl and other drugs in, of all places,
> hospitals.

Stunning behavior, when there are no rules.

> A leaked hospital memo in the province suggested nurses should help
> patients use hard drugs in the hospital rooms, in pursuit of “harm
> reduction,” Palmer reported.
>
> Sign up for Evening Brief
> Delivered weeknights, this email newsletter gives you a quick recap of
> the day's top stories and need-to-know news, as well as intriguing
> photos and topics to spark conversation as you wind down from your day.
>
> “Offer supplies and ensure they are easily accessible,” the memo
> instructed nurses. “If patient has an IV, provide education on injecting
> into lines.”
>
> It caused an uproar. It felt to some Canadians that the well-meaning
> goal of decriminalization — to remove drug addiction issues from jails —
> had morphed into letting people use drugs anywhere and everywhere.
>
> As Palmer put it: “A government that sought decriminalization of hard
> drugs seems to not have prepared for the consequences.”
>
> This past week, some elected officials in the province called to end the
> decriminalization experiment — as Oregon now has.
>
> “I have never seen this kind of open drug use … this level of
> encampments … this amount of suffering,” one Vancouver area city
> councilor said.

Progressive liberals have zero foresight.

> My view is the through line in all these West Coast progressive failures
> — yes, failures — isn’t that the big picture theory was wrong.
> Progressives are right that criminalizing homelessness or drug addiction
> is dumb and usually counterproductive. Jail is a sideshow at best to
> ultimately solving either problem.
>
> Most Read Local Stories
> Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat
> Eastside light rail line opens as huge crowds try out the ride  WATCH
> Woodland Park Zoo’s 45-year-old hippo, Water Lily, to be euthanized
> Oregon university pauses gifts, grants from Boeing over connections to
> Israel
> What to expect when you try the Eastside’s eight light rail stations
> But it also ought to be obvious by now that society can’t leap straight
> from red light all the way to full-on green. It’s not OK to build a
> plywood shack in a city park, any more than it is to smoke fentanyl on
> the bus or in a hospital room. It’s also not OK to refuse shelter and
> camp outside for years — not OK for the city and not for the person
> doing it.
>
> There’s got to be a middle space, where cities can still set rules and
> expectations without criminalizing the underlying poverty or addiction.
>
> Portugal is the place often credited for at least semisuccessfully
> decriminalizing drugs. But they explicitly did not create an atmosphere
> of anything goes. People caught with drugs in Portugal aren’t sent to
> criminal courts, but they’re given a summons to go before a “drug
> dissuasion” group with a doctor, a social worker and a legal expert.
> That group guides a treatment program and can impose penalties, from
> fines to revoking licenses to even bans on travel.
>
> It’s no war on drugs. But it’s also not advising you how to inject drugs
> into your bedside IV line.
>
> What has happened in the West Coast cities, over and over on
> homelessness, drugs and policing issues, is that we half-assed it. We
> did the ideological part first, and either ignored the make-it-work part
> or left it for later. Just as Seattle learned ruefully that you can’t
> defund police without first setting up public safety alternatives,
> Oregon found it’s self-defeating to decriminalize drugs without first
> setting up a robust treatment system.
>
> And so now the retreat is on, up and down the coast. Hopefully, as the
> pendulum swings back to the right, it won’t swing too far.
>
> If West Coast cities have learned anything from the upheaval of the past
> five years, it ought to be that the worst public policy mistakes, the
> kind you later have to embarrassingly unwind, happen when the pendulum
> really gets to swinging.

Progressives are stupid. You can't coddle these kinds of people and
expect them to pull themselves up. They can't. You have to go
hardcore. Put them into a stockade with assigned housing, scheduled
food and guards. Take the drugs away. Train them for one of five basic
jobs where their intelligence and motivation permits them to become
effective. If they can't handle any of the jobs, they go to the zombie
zone until they wise up and get with the program or die.

> Danny Westneat: dwestneat@seattletimes.com; Danny Westneat takes an
> opinionated look at the Puget Sound region's news, people and politics.


Click here to read the complete article

interests / alt.law-enforcement / Re: Even Portland now is banning camping, part of the West Coast retreat

1
server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.81
clearnet tor